2013 Castle Combe
Printed From: BHPC Forum
Category: Public: Open to anyone
Forum Name: BHPC Events
Forum Description: Come along and meet the club!
URL: https://forum.bhpc.org.uk/forum_posts.asp?TID=4847
Printed Date: 27 March 2026 at 1:57am Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.07 - https://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: 2013 Castle Combe
Posted By: Yanto
Subject: 2013 Castle Combe
Date Posted: 30 May 2013 at 10:40am
|
I became mixed up with dates and have entered a 6ookm audax on the 8-9 June, then I realised it was CC weekend, so I've decided to go racing instead. But, I still want to do some miles so, I'm loading up the Quest with camping gear and going to Lechlade on Thames (hopefully as haven't booked camping yet) on Saturday, Sunday I will trundle over to CC and race (ish), then trundle back to campsite, and cycle home Monday. Now I don't know if any BHPC peeps are close to Lechlade, but if they are, a bit of company on an evening in a local hostelry would be nice. If not I will eat/drink alone  ............
|
Replies:
Posted By: Yanto
Date Posted: 30 May 2013 at 4:56pm
|
Scrub all above, i'm driving down!
|
Posted By: graydog
Date Posted: 31 May 2013 at 8:22am
posted on behalf of Davius:
Hi, I'd be interested in entering, is it open to handcycles? Would you expect any other handcyclists there? What's the format? And can I enter on the day or does it need to be done online in advance? There are two of us in Taunton that are interested. Many thanks. (Tried sending you messages through the web site but it kept returning an error) Dave C
|
Posted By: graydog
Date Posted: 31 May 2013 at 8:35am
Dear Dave,
yes it is very much open to handcycle. we always hope to see a good turnout across the range, at Rhyl there were three, Preston one. It does vary.
CC is generally a 2hr event, although last year it was 30mins due to the heavy rain and wind. The multi-track faired were not so pleased.
The Final format has yet tbd, as organiser it was going to be a 3-4hr but to many members have said they will vote with their feet. Therefore, it might just have to be the standard type format.
YES!!!! you can entry on the day cost £7 for members £10 for non-members.
seems the race is just up the road then you will be more than welcome.
|
Posted By: fards
Date Posted: 01 June 2013 at 2:53pm
As it looks like I can make this one after all, 2 hours is most sensible option for this year. Maybe we can look at a longer(or even a race of different lengths) races for next year at cc, and promote it early enough to see if we can get some of our friends on the continent to come over? 50/100/150km type thing?
If we've got the track for long enough is there any reason someone couldn't carry on for an extra hour this time, after the 2 hours is up? As long as they are willing to do it under their own cognizance? Not for point scoring but as a chance to get some extra miles in. We've done that before with Scunthorpe although admittedly for a shorter race..
|
Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 01 June 2013 at 4:04pm
|
We've got the track booked until 6pm so no reason why people can't ride until then... It'll still be a BHPC event during our booking slot so will be covered by our insurance.
-------------
|
Posted By: Andy TS
Date Posted: 03 June 2013 at 1:10pm
will be doing a few laps after the race if its available. 
------------- Allewedder A2, Broken Optima Baron Lowracer
|
Posted By: Andy TS
Date Posted: 03 June 2013 at 2:41pm
And if anyone has a raptobike lowracer they wouldnt mind me having a couple of laps on after the race it would be much appreciated :-)
------------- Allewedder A2, Broken Optima Baron Lowracer
|
Posted By: graydog
Date Posted: 03 June 2013 at 9:51pm
ok for Sunday....
two races
60 mins CW 35% points split (14:30-15:30) 90 mins CCW 65% points split (16:00-17:30)
aiming to finish the 90min not later than 5:45..... and to give a break between races
it will be important to get on the track early as possilbe.
please have you machines ready and be ready to register.....
the 60 min race will includ the full total points for of the junior class. any Junior wishing to race in both will need parental consent
but will still score the full junior points in the 60min.
regards Graham
|
Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 03 June 2013 at 10:03pm
Thanks Graham...
-------------
|
Posted By: Yanto
Date Posted: 04 June 2013 at 8:31am
|
Sounds good! As an aside does anybody know if there any BHPC stickers knocking about? It would be good for people doing LEL to have them as we are in team "BHPC" and it might attract some potential members, although the audax crowd are generally not into speed, more beer, pies and cake - ah just like BHPC racers then 
|
Posted By: graydog
Date Posted: 04 June 2013 at 8:42am
I intend to get some vinals cut......
|
Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 04 June 2013 at 8:58am
May be worth speaking to Andy Forey... I think he got the last lot done...
-------------
|
Posted By: Andrew S
Date Posted: 04 June 2013 at 9:21am
graydog wrote:
60 mins CW 35% points split (14:30-15:30) 90 mins CCW 65% points split (16:00-17:30) ... the 60 min race will includ the full total points for of the junior class. | This might be quite difficult to score with the race software: some of the field will be doing a two round event (35:65) and the rest will be doing one round. Remember that Juniors aren't just in J class but also competing against others in U, P, S or whatever. It might be possible by fabricating results for those who don't compete in the 90 mins race so as to keep the averages right but it would be a good idea to sort out how you're going to do it before the race rather than afterwards.
|
Posted By: Andrew S
Date Posted: 04 June 2013 at 12:35pm
|
Access arrangements for Castle Combe next Sunday
Because of the car-boot sale in the morning the circuit want us to use the "Tower Gate" entrance, instead of the usual car park, and park on the campsite. This entrance is on the road that runs down the west side of the circuit, past the Camp Gate entrance that leads to the admin offices. This road turns off the main B4039 in Castle Combe village.
Unfortunately it's not that easy to find, or explain, if you haven't been to Castle Combe before, but this is what you are looking for:
http://goo.gl/maps/iMNxH" rel="nofollow - http://goo.gl/maps/iMNxH
The campsite has its own toilet/shower block and track entrance so we should be independent of all the car-bootery in the carpark. I shall aim to be there by 12:30pm at the latest to ensure everything is opened up and ready for sign on. http://https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=castle+combe&hl=en&ll=51.488294,-2.21875&spn=0.002418,0.00457&sll=52.954022,-1.170062&sspn=0.2995,0.585022&t=h&hnear=Castle+Combe,+Wiltshire,+United+Kingdom&z=18&layer=c&cbll=51.48835,-2.218775&panoid=5CzMTxmK0-nbvAXfw9x1dQ&cbp=12,81.32,,0,10" rel="nofollow -
|
Posted By: Andy TS
Date Posted: 04 June 2013 at 4:01pm
graydog wrote:
ok for Sunday....
60 mins CW 35% points split (14:30-15:30) 90 mins CCW 65% points split (16:00-17:30)
|
Eh? Sorry newbie... 
If I understand this right will be racing for 2.5hrs with a 30min break in between?
What is the CW and CCW classification for?
------------- Allewedder A2, Broken Optima Baron Lowracer
|
Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 04 June 2013 at 4:03pm
Andy TS wrote:
What is the CW and CCW classification for?
|
Clockwise and Counter-Clockwise...
-------------
|
Posted By: Andy TS
Date Posted: 04 June 2013 at 4:05pm
@Alan - Thanks, obvious when you think about it
------------- Allewedder A2, Broken Optima Baron Lowracer
|
Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 04 June 2013 at 4:08pm
30 minute break... loooxury... when I were a lad we used to race 48 hours non stop in bare feet and then walk home for a shift down t' pit... But you tell the kids of today that and they won't believe you... 
-------------
|
Posted By: fards
Date Posted: 05 June 2013 at 8:38am
|
I can smell the embrocation already!
|
Posted By: Twed
Date Posted: 05 June 2013 at 1:02pm
When ah were lad we used to drink embrocation.
------------- Never believe an atom they make up everything.
|
Posted By: Twed
Date Posted: 05 June 2013 at 1:17pm
IIRC, then you basically drive past the usual circuit entrances (on the left) untill you come across some houses and a S bend. In the middle of the S bend there is a tight turn to the left which takes you up a narrow lane. When you go up it, the track is on your left ....ignore the first turn (on left) ...carry on up a good distance where the gateway (on left) leads to the track/campsite. Can't remember details ....signs ...buildings etc. GST ....can't wait to tell a certain Junior of your plans ...she is after points in all categories ......so if I were you I'd wear armour!!
------------- Never believe an atom they make up everything.
|
Posted By: Andrew S
Date Posted: 05 June 2013 at 1:41pm
You've got it, Twed. Of course if you're coming the other way then the directions are quite different.
Annoyingly the 'narrow lane' is completely devoid of identifying features, such as a name or signpost, which makes it quite hard to give directions - I've e-stood at http://goo.gl/maps/hdU48" rel="nofollow - that corner many times in Google Street View looking for landmarks.
|
Posted By: graydog
Date Posted: 05 June 2013 at 3:53pm
Twed wrote:
GST ....can't wait to tell a certain Junior of your plans ...she is after points in all categories ......so if I were you I'd wear armour!! |
she is more than welcome to race up as any other year.... nothing different? hasen't she has chossen not to in the past ???
I must admit it was one of the things I first noticed in BHPC, CC was the first trake I ever raced. and was somthing I felt bhpc had right.... but must further admit think the UCi have it right with the max gear rule..... (well kinda)
cheers G
|
Posted By: Yanto
Date Posted: 05 June 2013 at 7:17pm
Andrew S wrote:
You've got it, Twed. Of course if you're coming the other way then the directions are quite different.
Annoyingly the 'narrow lane' is completely devoid of identifying features, such as a name or signpost, which makes it quite hard to give directions - I've e-stood at http://goo.gl/maps/hdU48" rel="nofollow - that corner many times in Google Street View looking for landmarks.
|
You can access the "narrow lane" from the A420, easy to find as it is opposite "The Crown Inn" (not a bad pub, or was when I used to frequent it, food is (was) good, but southern prices! Lane is sign posted "West Yatton", 100yds down the lane take the left fork (not to West Yatton), then down the dip of despair* and up the cliff of hope* and follow until you see the entrance to CC on the right. * driving isn't too bad, but try it on a bike, in the rain and you might understand!
|
Posted By: graydog
Date Posted: 08 June 2013 at 6:53pm
Twed wrote:
GST ....can't wait to tell a certain Junior of your plans ...she is after points in all categories ......so if I were you I'd wear armour!! |
due to the concerning threats of violence and make it easier for others to comprehend ratio splits
it might be easier to do a split junior 30min:30min race in each senior race. Thus totalling the 60min computing the same 7:13 splits......
but we can see which juniors turn out and work from there tomorrow....
please can somone book the weather?
regards G
|
Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 08 June 2013 at 6:56pm
I'm still working at the moment and struggling with a thigh strain so my planned complete domination of Castle Coombe is now looking less likely. :o(
-------------
|
Posted By: fards
Date Posted: 09 June 2013 at 11:38pm
Great races & glorious weather. My knee hurts!
Video of first lap of second race It should finish trimming the first bit of me pushing the quest to the start line soon. So hopefully by the time you watch this that sentence really won't make sense! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZFPMp-6RwjA" rel="nofollow - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZFPMp-6RwjA
|
Posted By: sam knight
Date Posted: 10 June 2013 at 6:39am
|
Many thanks to the organisers.... Thanks to John R for driving down all that way with the pedal car for me to try out. Thanks to everyone on track thanks to mother nature for smiling on us all this year. And big thanks to Fards and Yanto for letting me try out their Velomobiles after the racing....Want one!!!!!!!!!!!Having thought I was exhausted finding myself holding 30 mile an hour on a lap was quite an eye opener....Thanks guys.
------------- To be happy and not get killed.
|
Posted By: fards
Date Posted: 10 June 2013 at 6:48am
Had a comment on the video that really made be think! There was possibly one of the most eclectic mix of machines you're ever likely to see on track at once yesterday.
|
Posted By: graydog
Date Posted: 10 June 2013 at 9:30am
Big thanks to TD, JohnR, Steve......these guys really did the work
          
AS, for sorting the track.... and all you riders without whom it would have been a bit dull really
results to follow later
|
Posted By: blogwat
Date Posted: 10 June 2013 at 9:46am
|
Hi Ian
great video as always quick question what was the red and black striped velomobile no 131 not seen that before. is it wobbly bob in disguise.
Thanks .
Jeff.
------------- when your up to your waist in aligators they forget to tell you you've got to clear the swamp
|
Posted By: Andy TS
Date Posted: 10 June 2013 at 10:59am
|
What a great days racing - a big thanks to all the organisers and helpers.
Also thanks to the chap that helped me get started after binning the Wasp a few times on practice laps. Really need to get some practice in.
Here are a few photos from the second race my friend managed to get:
https://www.dropbox.com/home/HPV%20Castle%20Combe%20-%209%20June%202013#!/home/HPV%20Castle%20Combe%20-%209%20June%202013" rel="nofollow - https://www.dropbox.com/home/HPV%20Castle%20Combe%20-%209%20June%202013#!/home/HPV%20Castle%20Combe%20-%209%20June%202013
will add some more of the first race when i get them
------------- Allewedder A2, Broken Optima Baron Lowracer
|
Posted By: blogwat
Date Posted: 10 June 2013 at 3:58pm
Hi Andy
sorry to be a bit of a pudding but clicked on your link to the photo's and have created an account but can't get from there to the photo's not used dropbox before can you enlighten me  .
Jeff.
------------- when your up to your waist in aligators they forget to tell you you've got to clear the swamp
|
Posted By: Hedgehog
Date Posted: 10 June 2013 at 7:20pm
|
Alos can't get to them - it comes back with the folder does not exist.
But then I guess we have to be authorised to lookin your folders.
|
Posted By: fards
Date Posted: 10 June 2013 at 8:10pm
blogwat wrote:
Hi Ian
great video as always quick question what was the red and black striped velomobile no 131 not seen that before. is it wobbly bob in disguise.
Thanks .
Jeff. |
that was young master Tim's new toy.. Very very lovely, and in true bhpc tradition still being finished in the car park before the race. I've put photos up on my g+/picasa account. I'll stick them on Flickr soon. Here's the album https://picasaweb.google.com/m/viewer#album/105053136520471653574/5887752299478446321" rel="nofollow - https://picasaweb.google.com/m/vieiwer#album/105053136520471653574/5887752299478446321
|
Posted By: fards
Date Posted: 10 June 2013 at 8:15pm
The dropbox link from Andy ts points to a generic /home. That's why can't see the ;) Wondered why you had the same files on your dropbox that I've got Andy :D.
|
Posted By: Yanto
Date Posted: 10 June 2013 at 8:29pm
|
Can't access either of them, both require a log on!
|
Posted By: Yanto
Date Posted: 10 June 2013 at 8:54pm
|
I would like to add my thanks to all organisers, do-ers, and riders for a cracking if hot and tiring day out! So hot in fact that my velo burst it's radiator on the finish line! Thankfully it was only sweat that was pouring out of the bottom of it, when I un-bunged all the drainage holes there must have been at least a pint running out! And never before has some one said such a nice thing to me when sitting in my velo' as; "Your sweat is quite refreshing actually!"
|
Posted By: sam knight
Date Posted: 10 June 2013 at 9:41pm
Yeah thanks again for allowing me to sit in your sweat bath....You guys are right though, I defo require a velomobile of some description in my life now....It's not a 'want' it's a 'must have'....
------------- To be happy and not get killed.
|
Posted By: fards
Date Posted: 10 June 2013 at 10:23pm
sam knight wrote:
Yeah thanks again for allowing me to sit in your sweat bath....You guys are right though, I defo require a velomobile of some description in my life now....It's not a 'want' it's a 'must have'.... | Oh yes..... We did warn you ;) it's a virus, it gets worse as the virus spreads throughout your nervous system until you finally give in and obtain one somehow! Making one from a trike isn't as hard as it sounds, as long as you've got a trike handy that is..
|
Posted By: Andy TS
Date Posted: 10 June 2013 at 10:58pm
Not used dropbox much myself so Will stick them in picasa instead.
------------- Allewedder A2, Broken Optima Baron Lowracer
|
Posted By: blogwat
Date Posted: 11 June 2013 at 9:02am
|
Dear mr Fards
I have clicked on your link and signed in and it brings up Shrewsbury and Hillingdon 1 photo's am I just missing something or plain stupid ( don't answer that ) any ideas.
thanks Jeff.
------------- when your up to your waist in aligators they forget to tell you you've got to clear the swamp
|
Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 11 June 2013 at 9:58am
sam knight wrote:
I defo require a velomobile of some description in my life now....It's not a 'want' it's a 'must have'.... | Ah I can picture the scene here at Chateau Goodman... "Maureen, you know you've been saying for ages you'd like to replace that old banger you drive before it completely falls to pieces... well it may have to wait another couple of years old girl because there's this velomobile I need... It would reduce my carbon footprint you know..."
-------------
|
Posted By: graydog
Date Posted: 11 June 2013 at 11:57am
Urgent CALL to all who went to Castle Combe!!!!
WHO TOOK THE BLUE RACE KIT BOX?
WHO TOOK THE SIGN ON SHEETS? I was passed the timing sheets and the Sign-on were on the table.
With out them the race numbers don't mean a lot!! so you will not get results untill I have the list
Who ever has the sheets, please photo them and emial me graydog68 at gmail.com
you can remain unnamed 
kind regards Gd
|
Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 11 June 2013 at 12:02pm
Not all on video??
-------------
|
Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 11 June 2013 at 12:06pm
Or as long as you have the race numbers the names will come up when you enter the number into the spreadsheet (assuming the person has raced before...)That should sort most of it out... 
-------------
|
Posted By: graydog
Date Posted: 11 June 2013 at 12:31pm
Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 11 June 2013 at 12:33pm
I'm sure I did 18...  Best bet is to put the results up as they are - I'm sure people will shout if the classes are wrong...
-------------
|
Posted By: graydog
Date Posted: 11 June 2013 at 12:36pm
I'll hold for a few hours, could be someone needed some loo paper.... but just in case, see if they turn up.
|
Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 11 June 2013 at 12:38pm
graydog wrote:
I'll hold for a few hours, could be someone needed some loo paper.... but just in case, see if they turn up.
|
BHPC Sign-on sheets... Soft, strong and thoroughly absorbent... 
-------------
|
Posted By: John R
Date Posted: 11 June 2013 at 1:11pm
|
I believe it was John Lucian who took the kit as he is going to Scunthorpe. What numbers are you not sure of as I can remember most of them.
|
Posted By: graydog
Date Posted: 11 June 2013 at 6:43pm
PLEASE can all who helped tripple check they have not got the clipboard with sign-on sheets attached?
or a set of sign on sheets?
as filled out Sunday
thanks Graham
|
Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 11 June 2013 at 8:10pm
Shout if you want a hand working out the results from what you have Graham.. As long as you have a finish order, number of laps and a race time for all competitors (just the bike numbers will do - I'm sure we can suss out who was riding what...) everything else should be possible from the video, photographs or just what people remember... If we post the results up with the info you have we could then ask people to help fill in any gaps...
-------------
|
Posted By: graydog
Date Posted: 11 June 2013 at 9:51pm
Who was
104 (yes I know Heather, someone stole your number) 12 (was that you Glen?) 42 (phil??)
|
Posted By: GeoffBird
Date Posted: 11 June 2013 at 9:55pm
Can I say that I'm almost certain I won both races by some margin ;-)
------------- Right Time - Right Place - Wrong Speed
|
Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 11 June 2013 at 9:58pm
GeoffBird wrote:
Can I say that I'm almost certain I won both races by some margin ;-)
|
An impressive performance on an arm-powered sports class machine!
-------------
|
Posted By: John R
Date Posted: 11 June 2013 at 10:36pm
|
Think we might have had Andrew down as 104 on the lap sheets instead of 102. If they finished about 5th and 6th it was. 12 was Glen and 42 was the chap on the red Bike Friday but not sure of his name. Hope that helps.
|
Posted By: graydog
Date Posted: 12 June 2013 at 7:50am
John R wrote:
Think we might have had Andrew down as 104 on the lap sheets instead of 102. If they finished about 5th and 6th it was. 12 was Glen and 42 was the chap on the red Bike Friday but not sure of his name. Hope that helps. |
ok 42 check.....
ar yes the video paly back show 102(name withheld to protect rider identity  riding as Heather.
|
Posted By: Andrew S
Date Posted: 12 June 2013 at 10:48am
graydog wrote:
Who was
104 (yes I know Heather, someone stole your number) 12 (was that you Glen?) 42 (phil??) | 42 was a new guy: Geoff Searle riding a Bike Friday. No idea about classes but you can probably get that from the video.
I'd had a few emails from Geoff before Castle Combe. He's doing LEJoG in early July on the BF.
|
Posted By: graydog
Date Posted: 12 June 2013 at 11:04am
Thanks Andrew
his class is o/p/u/s/st..... from video....
kind regards G
|
Posted By: Karl
Date Posted: 12 June 2013 at 11:16am
|
All correct 42 was a new face but he has been a member for a long time even though he doesnt race, he was parked next to me in the carpark.
Nice bloke, using the Castle Combe as part of his training.
Regards Karl
|
Posted By: Andy TS
Date Posted: 12 June 2013 at 11:27am
|
Some photos from the second race - will add race 1 photos when i get them
https://plus.google.com/photos/112928157230611468079/albums/5888538458827928561" rel="nofollow - https://plus.google.com/photos/112928157230611468079/albums/5888538458827928561
Hopefully this one should work
------------- Allewedder A2, Broken Optima Baron Lowracer
|
Posted By: tincanracer
Date Posted: 12 June 2013 at 12:02pm
|
Hi Graham, No 12 was me, Stuart Glen, Kingcycle. If you lost the results I think I did 40 laps! Cheers Stuart
------------- Laid Back in Spirit
|
Posted By: graydog
Date Posted: 12 June 2013 at 12:21pm
60min CW 35% points all appeals must be submitted with signed agreement from greatgrand parents and a bottle of wine.... the more expensive the more change you have of getting you appeal through!
failing that pleease look over the list of laps..... let the bun throwing begin!!
|
Posted By: graydog
Date Posted: 12 June 2013 at 12:25pm
75min race as prev data....
please note the clock times are when you crossed or stopped so the order is wrong as appears here, is post is to valitate mainly the Junior formate/times.
|
Posted By: Andrew S
Date Posted: 12 June 2013 at 4:39pm
|
Many thanks Graham. My results (102!) are right for both races. Mike B lapped me once around the 1hr mark in both so his look good too.
|
Posted By: blogwat
Date Posted: 12 June 2013 at 4:52pm
|
Hi Andy
Thanks for the photo's young master tim's new machine looks amazing the wheels look fully enclosed if so how does he steer .
Jeff.
------------- when your up to your waist in aligators they forget to tell you you've got to clear the swamp
|
Posted By: tim.p
Date Posted: 15 June 2013 at 10:37am
the bodywork is wide enough for the wheels to turn inside, the turning circle is somewhat reduced, but enough to get around a racetrack
------------- more speed!
|
Posted By: blogwat
Date Posted: 15 June 2013 at 10:35pm
|
Thanks Tim.
Jeff.
------------- when your up to your waist in aligators they forget to tell you you've got to clear the swamp
|
Posted By: graydog
Date Posted: 16 June 2013 at 6:55pm
|
last call for sticky bun fight on the CC results!!! 24HR notice
|
Posted By: Andrew S
Date Posted: 01 July 2013 at 4:41pm
The final results for Castle Combe are now posted on the website here:
http://www.bhpc.org.uk/Data/Sites/1/archive/events/events13/castlecombe-13.html" rel="nofollow - www.bhpc.org.uk/Data/Sites/1/archive/events/events13/castlecombe-13.html
and the post-CC Championship Tables are here:
http://www.bhpc.org.uk/Data/Sites/1/archive/events/events13/tables13.html" rel="nofollow - www.bhpc.org.uk/Data/Sites/1/archive/events/events13/tables13.html
|
Posted By: Twed
Date Posted: 03 July 2013 at 12:46pm
Hmmmm just one small observation on the Championship tables ......I really don't think Sarah should have Ladies part-faired points for CC. I don't think it will effect anyone greatly, but she was most certainly fully faired.
------------- Never believe an atom they make up everything.
|
Posted By: KevinJ
Date Posted: 03 July 2013 at 4:42pm
OK - will adjust - thanks - Presume that is Street and Sports out as well then :)
------------- Kevin Jenkins
Windcheetah
|
|