2022 - Gravesend - 17th and 18th September.
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URL: https://forum.bhpc.org.uk/forum_posts.asp?TID=7452
Printed Date: 27 March 2026 at 1:06am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.07 - https://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: 2022 - Gravesend - 17th and 18th September.
Posted By: AlanGoodman
Subject: 2022 - Gravesend - 17th and 18th September.
Date Posted: 04 September 2022 at 7:22pm
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Race Format: Saturday 17th September (we have the track from 12 noon) 12 noon – register that you are there and warm up 1.00pm – 0.24 mile oval track. 2 x 20 or 3 x 15 minute races dependent on number of racers 2.45pm – 0.84 mile lower track. 2 x 45 minute plus one lap races split into slower and faster racers. 10am – register that you are there and warm up 11am – 0.84 mile lower track. 1 lap time trial 12.30pm – approx. 1 mile combined oval and lower track. 90 minutes plus one lap, all racers together. ------------- |
Replies:
Posted By: LWaB
Date Posted: 04 September 2022 at 9:07pm
| Can the oval track race go round clockwise this time? With LH drive on my trike, I was getting a lot of wheelspin last time going anti-clockwise. |
Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 04 September 2022 at 10:40pm
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Hmm. We'll need to allow time to move the timing gear and tent between upper and lower tracks on Saturday. Where were you proposing we put the finish line on the lower track? I think last time we considered it, we decided the flat straight was a bad idea, as it put the timing tent directly in the run-off zone. Possibly in the middle of the lower hairpin would work (I *think* that's grass, rather than bushes?), if we made sure the races only went in the direction that wouldn't cause spurious tag reads.
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Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 04 September 2022 at 10:41pm
Something something wrong hemisphere...
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LWaB wrote:Posted By: RoyMacdonald
Date Posted: 08 September 2022 at 4:18pm
Stickier (wider) tyres? All the best. Roy |
Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 08 September 2022 at 4:24pm
I think the other reason we went anti-clockwise last year was because of Slash’s close encounter with a tree going clockwise the previous year.  ------------- |
Posted By: LWaB
Date Posted: 08 September 2022 at 11:44pm
| Some of us have a high centre of gravity. There isn’t much traction when your drive wheel is in the air, no matter how sticky it is. Lifting an idler wheel doesn’t stop you putting the power down. |
Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 09 September 2022 at 12:46am
| Maybe we could run the slow race in one direction and the fast race in the other, at the same time, like in the Large Hadron Collider? |
Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 09 September 2022 at 6:42am
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Posted By: LWaB
Date Posted: 09 September 2022 at 7:41am
| Now that would be some game of chicken! |
Posted By: RoyMacdonald
Date Posted: 09 September 2022 at 12:20pm
Time for a new design? (or just don't race on that track) Not every track suits the Beano so Steve only races on the ones that do. My Wasp used to have massive traction problems due to my light weight and being front wheel drive. I got a new bike in the end, with rear wheel drive. All the best. Roy
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Posted By: RoyMacdonald
Date Posted: 09 September 2022 at 5:36pm
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Dave, were you proposing to ride your high trike? I didn't realise it only had one driven wheel. I guess it would need a diff if it had two. I guess that is why everyone designs trikes with two front wheels and one driven rear. The only answer other than a different trike or bike would be to go slow enough not to lift the driven wheel in sharp corners. It's what I would do if it were me racing that kind of trike. Or use your Brompton. All the best. Roy |
Posted By: Dan Bergonzi
Date Posted: 09 September 2022 at 5:39pm
| The Fast Saturday race on the Oval reminds me of the film "Death Race 2000" |
Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 09 September 2022 at 6:00pm
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Put a fixed wheel transmission on it and ride backwards... (Interestingly, doing this was the only time I've ever found riding an upright trike to be completely intuitive.)
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Posted By: yostumpy
Date Posted: 09 September 2022 at 6:12pm
or even Rollerball
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Posted By: Dan Bergonzi
Date Posted: 09 September 2022 at 6:15pm
| Rollerball it is |
Posted By: yostumpy
Date Posted: 09 September 2022 at 6:15pm
| Can you not put the timing gear in the grass center of the oval, in the middle of the lowest bend, then as that section is used by upper and lower tracks.....? |
Posted By: LWaB
Date Posted: 09 September 2022 at 6:40pm
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Oh, I will just ride the upright trike and moan about how much better I would have done if we were riding the other direction. That will conceal my lack of fitness quite nicely and preserve my fragile male ego when I get trounced by a little kid or something. Most nice upright trikes have a double freewheel with half axles, so the power goes to the rear wheel turning the slowest. The exact same drive mechanism got purloined for the Quattrovelo. A differential pushes power to the wheel turning the fastest, so you lose drive every time you lift a wheel. Cheap trikes like mine use a one wheel drive that partially compensates for camber but is a pain when pedalling through a corner the wrong way. |
Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 09 September 2022 at 7:32pm
https://goo.gl/maps/BvEUD7z9pN4Tmprp9" rel="nofollow - *peers at google satellite view* No, because: a) The lower bend of the oval is full of shrubbery (and occasionally junior cyclocrossers) b) The cut-through that forms the lower loop of the track is separate from the oval c) The green area on the space between them isn't tent-friendly (and appears to have a MTB underpass in it) Personally, I think we should stick to using the oval and the full circuit, and having the finish line in the usual place on the north straight of the oval where there's a decent amount of space, good sightlines and low risk of crashes. It would make timing operations considerably less stressful. (It also eliminates a nasty hairpin and would be less of a trek to the facilities.)
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Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 14 September 2022 at 2:56pm
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Looks like the company that hosts the BHPC websites has been having connectivity issues. It's reachable now (as evidenced by this post) but I'd suggest anyone intending to do a last-minute registration for Gravesend do it sooner rather than later, in case it goes down again. https://shop.bhpc.org.uk/gravesend-2022-sat-17th-sun-18th-september" rel="nofollow - https://shop.bhpc.org.uk/gravesend-2022-sat-17th-sun-18th-september
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Posted By: legs_larry
Date Posted: 14 September 2022 at 9:14pm
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It rather spoiled Andrew's proposed lie-in this morning... ------------- ==================== a bit ov a lyv wyr by slof standirds |
Posted By: yostumpy
Date Posted: 15 September 2022 at 4:51pm
| Are there any stickers kicking around that someone could bring to Gravesend, 2 pairs if possible, I lost mine, that I bought 2 years ago, and they are out of stock now |
Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 15 September 2022 at 4:53pm
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Chris Hamilton had the stock of them and was sending them out for us. Not sure if there are any left but I don’t think he’s coming to Gravesend though. ------------- |
Posted By: LWaB
Date Posted: 17 September 2022 at 12:17pm
| Ive been slowed down on the M25 and will arrive at 12:50. |
Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 17 September 2022 at 10:11pm
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Results for Saturday are now up at http://www.bhpc.org.uk/Data/Sites/1/media/events/events22/10gravesend/index.html" rel="nofollow - http://www.bhpc.org.uk/Data/Sites/1/media/events/events22/10gravesend/index.html And I've provisionally updated the championship table at http://bhpc.org.uk/Data/Sites/1/media/events/events22/BHPC_2022.html" rel="nofollow - http://bhpc.org.uk/Data/Sites/1/media/events/events22/BHPC_2022.html (Using 40:60 weighting, as nobody proposed anything else.)
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Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 17 September 2022 at 10:29pm
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Many thanks Kim!! Great job as always! Gravesend is a great circuit and it was really good fun even though I couldn’t seem to get going on the Speedy today for some reason. ------------- |
Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 17 September 2022 at 10:43pm
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I did reasonably well in the 15 minute race, but the 45min went to pot with the wind catching me as I entered the first bend at higher speed than I've done before (thanks to the tailbox), and then going off-piste on the second difficult corner finished off what confidence I might have had. Also, I fitted a closer-ratio cassette for Rhyl, which worked well enough at Bath and Darley Moor, but was completely wrong for the lower loop at Gravesend, leaving me with a choice between an awkward front shift or mashing on the climb. I may fit my road wheel tomorrow, which has an 11-32 on it. Natalya seemed to be having fun, in spite of various limbs and organs being unhelpful.
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Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 17 September 2022 at 10:51pm
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Great to see Natalya racing and smiling all the way! Also I thought Alice was going really well!! I don’t know how old she is but I’ve got a nasty feeling she’s going to be lapping me before much longer!! ------------- |
Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 19 September 2022 at 12:17am
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Right, I've uploaded the results for today: http://www.bhpc.org.uk/Data/Sites/1/media/events/events22/11gravesend/index.html" rel="nofollow - http://www.bhpc.org.uk/Data/Sites/1/media/events/events22/11gravesend/index.html No problem with the 1-lap time trial, which went smoothly. Unfortunately, due to a software issue, we have no timing data for the first ~23 minutes of the 90-minute race. This is because Natalya started CrossMgr, then jumped on her trike and rode ~5 laps before DNFing, at which point she realised something serious was wrong. She then flagged me down to troubleshoot the problem, which I resolved quickly. All timing data *after* 24 minutes seems to be pretty robust - there are no missed tag reads. About the only exciting things that happened from a timing perspective were Jonathan Woolrich stopping (after coming off?) at the bottom of the track at about 35 minutes, and Adam Robinson DNFing at about 42 minutes. I've re-created my own lap times from my GPS recording (and I'm reasonably sure that David Griffiths was within a few seconds of me at the point that I stopped); approximated Jochen's lap times based on the convenient lap analysis shown by Strava; gratuitously fabricated some lap times for Natalya (who is in a separate class so will get the same points regardless); and gestimated everyone else's splits based on the speed they were doing in subsequent laps. The finish order looks reasonable, let me know if you know differently...
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Posted By: AlanGoodman
Date Posted: 19 September 2022 at 5:50am
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Many thanks Kim (and Natalya!) ------------- |
Posted By: LWaB
Date Posted: 19 September 2022 at 7:08am
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Mr Woolrich definitely came off. He was proudly wearing a well-ventilated set of knicks while having a coffee afterwards. Who knows what horrors were hidden beneath? I saw him just about to get back on, made the decision that he obviously wasn’t too injured and I kept racing. Sorry, if that wasn’t the right thing to do. A small correction - Judith was not car-free for Gravesend. |
Posted By: david.lhostis
Date Posted: 19 September 2022 at 8:24am
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In the 90 minutes lap, I did lap Jochen, although he unlapped me at the end, so I was ahead of him by nearly one lap and must have ridden one lap more than him ( so a priori -2 instead of -3) Did Adam Robinson really won the 1 lap tt on a hpv streetmachine? ------------- http://ccgi.lhostis.plus.com/sport.php" rel="nofollow - http://ccgi.lhostis.plus.com/sport.php Optima baron XLow + M5 Sandwich fairing |
Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 19 September 2022 at 12:16pm
Okay, fixed that.
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Posted By: farwer
Date Posted: 19 September 2022 at 12:24pm
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That's right. David was almost 1lap ahead. Jochen |
Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 19 September 2022 at 12:24pm
Okay, I've given you 11 splits rather than 10, which fixes that.
Not even slightly. It looks like CrossMgr recorded (but rightly ignored) a short second lap for him (presumably he went round the oval or wheeled his bike past the reader or something) that just happened to be almost exactly half his time for the first, so it decided there must have been a missed read and extrapolated! Fixed that. I'm not sure how I didn't notice it before, it's not like he wasn't at the top of the list with the lap time highlighted in yellow. Must be tired.
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Posted By: Grifff
Date Posted: 19 September 2022 at 1:24pm
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Hi Thanks for your excellent work as usual! I was certainly right behind you when you pulled over (unashamedly wheel sucking😁). The only thing I can see is I am pretty certain I lapped 59 but I didn't lap Steve Marsh. Not that it makes a lot of difference but maybe Steve was 2nd in the open multitrack? Thanks again for the tow👍 |
Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 19 September 2022 at 1:58pm
| That suggests Ian Pike (59) had 8 splits rather than 9, which also gives reasonable looking times. Fixed. |
Posted By: NigelSlee
Date Posted: 19 September 2022 at 2:20pm
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Great weekend! Learnt loads about race craft and cornering. Amazed by the speedy uploading of results. Thanks! I've uploaded some pics into a Google photo album - slow and fast 15 mins races. http://photos.app.goo.gl/W1hmsMc2P6WSQykW7" rel="nofollow - https://photos.app.goo.gl/W1hmsMc2P6WSQykW7  http://photos.app.goo.gl/J8PMBuJuMAtFfp2aA" rel="nofollow - https://photos.app.goo.gl/J8PMBuJuMAtFfp2aA
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Posted By: liam
Date Posted: 19 September 2022 at 7:15pm
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Garmin put my average at 22mph for the 90 minute. I know Aeryn
overtook me near the end, but I'm pretty sure I overtook her back. She
may well have been a lap up on me though. Thanks for all the timing magic you do 😀 ------------- Notso - 36 |
Posted By: yostumpy
Date Posted: 19 September 2022 at 7:52pm
Saturday still says car free.
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Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 19 September 2022 at 8:46pm
Yep, you did a little dance on Lap 34. CrossMgr speeds are always worth taking with a pinch of salt (being based on a nominal track distance, not the line you actually took), but they do look a bit low. 10 splits gives better-looking numbers than 9 (unless you had a really slow first lap, which seems unlikely, as you overtook me fairly promptly), which would put you ahead of Aeryn on the same lap.
Any sufficiently advanced technology and all that. I think I've worked out how to reproduce the problem, at least (and worked out the cause of a different previous failure in the process), so hopefully I'll be able to feed that back to the developers so it gets fixed.
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Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 19 September 2022 at 8:47pm
Yes, well, it would help if I actually uploaded the HTML...
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Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 23 September 2022 at 6:47pm
| Good news: I've managed to reproduce the bug that caused the problem with Sunday's 90 minute race, and https://github.com/esitarski/CrossMgr/issues/95" rel="nofollow - reported it to the developers . |
Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 30 September 2022 at 3:48pm
And it looks like this is now fixed.  (tl;dr: There was an unhandled TCP socket exception in CrossMgrImpinj that would only occur if you got the timing of the mouseclick perfectly wrong.)
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Posted By: Yanto
Date Posted: 30 September 2022 at 3:57pm
Erm ok
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Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 30 September 2022 at 4:35pm
This is, sadly, what it's like trying to do anything useful with computers. It's all like this. All of it. The only way to stay sane is to go for a bike ride.
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Posted By: farwer
Date Posted: 30 September 2022 at 5:07pm
Kim, after writing your strava_upload.sh script in crazy bash syntax you certainly need a long bike ride 
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Posted By: Kim
Date Posted: 30 September 2022 at 5:22pm
More than one. That was largely an exercise in getting better at bash programming. It didn't help.
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Posted By: david.lhostis
Date Posted: 27 February 2023 at 10:50pm
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This is my video for this event https://youtu.be/otYinmS-DKI ------------- http://ccgi.lhostis.plus.com/sport.php" rel="nofollow - http://ccgi.lhostis.plus.com/sport.php Optima baron XLow + M5 Sandwich fairing |